Street vs. Track

[ZX9R]

Which is better metzler or michellin?

And for which purpose Street or Track?

190 rear or 180?

[DarcShadow]

That's a loaded question. It greatly depends on what you want as to which is better. I like the M1 on front and M3 on rear for street riding. Track I haven't decided yet. So far though, out side of race tires, I like the M1 front and rear the best.

As for 190 vs 180, that depends on the bike. A 180 will turn in a little easier but it'll also change the geometry of the bike if the bike was setup for a 190. You might be able to adjust/tweek the suspension and ride height and get a much better handling or then again you might not. That would be a good question for Scott at Cycle Werkz.

[Blizzard_1708]

too bad they quit making the M1, looks like you'll have to find a new front tire

[GSXRRider]

I like Pirelli which is who makes Metzelers, but they cost too much.


The M1 is discontinued in most sizes and is my all time favorite tire but they still make them for the liter bikes.

As for size run the one that the manufacturer put on your bike. I went from a 190 to a 180 thinking it would dive in faster. It did but on the track who cares a bigger patch is more important than the milliseconds gained turning in.

[beercap]

Hey ZX9R Bro,

My 999R comes stock with Michelin Pilot Race, 190 on the back.

Jeff from AMS outfited me with a 180 rear one time I was due for new
tires, but I hadn't noticed it until a few track days after.

I remember the bike was so easy to throw from side to side,
loved the performance. When I asked him about the change,
he indicated Ducati put a "Fat" stock tire for looks, and recommeded
I stick to the 180 if I was going to do track racing. Jeff is a former
Daytona Champion, and I utterly agree with him from this experience.

I am back to 190 since Traci is not allowed at the track anymore,
she does look better with the fatter rear

Regarding manufacturer's, this is like choosing religion nominations,
I've had Michelin Pilot Race and the Power, and now have Dunlop
Qualifiers which are quite grippy... surprised to say. Only reason I won't
go back to Michelin Race is they have a short life, very sticky, but not
worth their price for their endurance.


Hope this give you insights to your questions.

Cheers
Beercap

[vagrant]

Personally, if my bike came with 190, i would stick with 190. But since it didnt, I have no worries. I would not change from a 180stock UP to a 190. As you prob dont need the added traction, and you will have slower turn in (not an really issue unless you are trying to beat Ty Howard's lap records).

You should also note that the 180-190 or vice versa change will be different for different makes and models of tire. They all have different profiles. It also depends on the width of your rim. If your rim is "thinner" (designed for a 180) then it will pinch the 190 a lot making for a more "pointy" profile at the center and really steep on the sides - not the profile intended by the manufacturer. So it is also dependent on your bike/rims.

Then there is the question of the front tire. After my little incident on the track, I used the opportunity to change my front tire hieght from 65 stock to 75. I had read that it "improves turn in" and all that. Well all I can say is, I really didnt like it that much. It felt like there was a point/lean angle on the profile after which the bike felt like it was literally falling. Weirdest feeling. Thought I was washing out the front the first few times. After that it was difficult for me to lean past that point because I didnt like how it felt. Now I also changed tire make/model (from M3 to Pirelli Diablo Corsa front meduim-soft rear medium-hard) so that may have contributed too. Some would also say it was a residual affect from my accident. I dont necessarily agree with that but cant prove it, as I didnt change back to the original tires.

From now on, I wil stick to the original setup of the bike (regarding tire height/width) and continue the eternal search for the perfect tire.

WHY OH WHY DID YOU STOP MAKING M1's Metzler!!??!!

[Firewa11]

WHY OH WHY DID YOU STOP MAKING M1's Metzler!!??!!

So they would sell more M3's

[Bird]

I've done both Michelin (Power Street and Race) and Metzler (M3) on the Bird. Granted, it's not really a sport bike, but it gives me a chance to see what the rest of you are feeling on a ride. You have to factor in the cost of the tires and how you're going to use them. Best combo is to get a set of track tires and only use them on the track and keep your street tires on the rest of the time.

For reasonable stickiness, predictable degradation and long life, I'd have to vote for the M3s. I'm on my second consecutive set and can't fault them. Then again, I'm not leaving 1/2 lb of rubber at MSR every few months either.

[Bird Shooter]

Here is what I like:

Street- My first choice from a "sticky" perspective would be the M1's(if you can get them in your size). They have awesome grip for a street tire. The only downfall is that they only last around 1,500 miles on the rear, the way I ride. It can get pretty costly if you ride allot.

My second choice would be the Michelin Pilot Power/M3's. Some people say Power's get "greasy" after about 3,000 miles but hey, it's 3,000 miles. The M3's have been "alright". I really am not too impressed with the feel, but they have been an o.k. choice for the miles. I will put at least one more M3 rear tire on before I try the new Pilot Power 2CT's, which are supposed to be more "grippy".

I don't like Bridgestone's or Dunlop's. Although, I haven't tried the new Qualifier yet.

Track- First choice is Michelin Power Race in the medium dual compound. These tires are awesome coupled with tire warmers. You need to run around 22 psi in the rear to get the full advantage and around 29-31 psi in the front.

I have ran Metzeler Race Tech's before and they are a good track day tire, but probably not as well for an "all out" race pace. I like the Power Race better for their "feel".

The best tires I have ever ran are Pirelli Diablo Superbike slicks. Problem is, you can't purchase them. Man, these tires rock! No wonder race teams use them. Imagine pouring super glue all over the track and twisting the throttle as hard as you want, granted they are hot. If they are cold, they are ice skates.

I want to try the Dunlop GP's this year and may try some Bridgestones as long as they are somewhat affordable, but it looks like I will stay with the Michelin's for the time being.

Note: Most people think that just because you are using race tires, they are more sticky and safer to run fast on. This is not necessarily true. You have to either use tire warmers or run some very hot laps "pushing hard and breaking hard" to get them to temperature (usually around 160 to 175 degrees fahrenheit). If you don't warm them up, they can be down right dangerous. If they are hot, they are like a dream. In conclusion, Pilot Powers or M1's might be a good choice for the occasional track day rider because they operate at lower temperatures and are easier to warm up.

180 or 190? - Liter bikes = 190; 600's-750's = 180

Not to sound like a "know it all", just giving you all my experiences.

[vagrant]

good post. nice change from the usual

[Bird Shooter]

Thanks Vagranutz! I think?

[ZX9R]

PeeShooter Vagrant was talking about me I think! Tell you you by the beer and we can dicuss it futher.

[vagrant]

is that like a double negative? "you you" becomes "me" right?

" Tell you you by the beer and we can dicuss it futher"
becomes
"Tell ME by the beer and we can dicuss it futher"

[ZX9R]

freakin I hate smart people people. I am gonna let you slide on that one jet boy.